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 CAD, CAM, CNC etc. 
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Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 1:18 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Kitwn wrote:
D1,
Maybe the cost of the tube explains why the machine was in a skip in the first place?

Kit

Yep they didn't want to risk buying and fitting a new tube themselves. They also wanted a bigger, one actually now i have put a bigger tube in this one its exactly the same as their new one . He how dares wins :D
Theirs a new breed of lasers out their http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Engraving-las ... SwDFNWFRAH . No ware near as powerful as the CO2 laser but relatively cheap and getting cheaper . Because of their small physical size the can be mounted on the end of most CNC x y things routers etc . No need for complicated mirrors to bounce beam about .
Maybe give it some thought theirs no physical contact with machined material so the CNC doesn't have to be as robust as say when using a spindle motor .


Ps these things may be band or restricted shortly the idiots out their think its fun to blind people.
D1


Sat Dec 12, 2015 1:24 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
I'm interested in having a laser cutter as I want to try making a 'The Bear and The Hare' style animation without having to cut out the pieces by hand! From looking at some of the other videos that get linked from those you've shown, I think a much less powerful laser will be able to cut the foamcore I'd be using.

Something like this perhaps...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/808nm-300mw-CW- ... 1627352917


Sat Dec 12, 2015 5:52 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Of course the chat about laser cutters set me off Googling...
Did you know how easy it is to build a Carbon Dioxide laser at home from junk and hardware store bits? And CO2 laser output powers are always measured in Watts rather than milliWatts. It's actually a bit scary what some nutter could do with one of these, but loads more fun than Lego!

On a more serious note: I'm beginning to get the hang of this CAD stuff. The new, much stiffer X and Z axis assemblies will look a bit like this (without the swanky colours)...

Attachment:
File comment: Fusion 360 render of new X/Z axis assembly.
CNCXaxis2.png
CNCXaxis2.png [ 74.06 KiB | Viewed 10007 times ]


Mon Dec 14, 2015 1:37 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Hi Kit didn't realise you could build your own CO2 laser . Looking at the two i have it must be very difficult, but be people do get up to very odd things in sheds !
My new tube is 60 watts and yes i think you could get up to some serious mischief with it .
Must admit i was a bit skeptical about a 300mw diode laser been able to do much . These low power laser rely on you doing lots of passes . If you are considering one of these in the future i would get the highest wattage you can stretch to financially.
CAD looking good will stick with Designspark and Blender though . Have a look at Blender if you haven't already its great for effects and many other things .
D1


Mon Dec 14, 2015 2:16 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
D1,
It's not at all difficult to make your own CO2 laser. You need a glass tube (old flouro tubes are popular) a water jacket (plastic pipe), some plumbing fittings, mirrors cut from old hard drive platters, a vacuum pump ( old fridge compressor), some needle valves to control the gas flow (this will be a continuously pumped system), a 20-100kV power supply (Tesla coil), a rock-salt crystal, a gas reservoir (party balloon), plenty of epoxy glue or a hot-glue gun, a few other bits and pieces you can knock up with ordinary hand tools and a suitable mixture of Carbon Dioxide, Nitrogen and Helium (you can get away without the Helium and use your own expired breath if the rest of the device is well made!!! Add helium from a party balloon to increase power).

The downside is that the less-than-perfect DIY laser needs to be a bit longer than the commercial tubes to get enough gain for reliable lasing, but if you wanted to build a cutting table a metre wide or more, you could give it a try.

All you need to do then is NOT:

a) Burn holes in the corneas of your eyes.
b) Burn your house down.
c) Electrocute yourself.
d) Let the police find out. They'd be bound to tell someone who'd worry about what you're up to.

What IS potentially interesting to owners of existing laser cutters is that when you find the expensive, delicate, gold plated mirrors in need of replacement, you can make your own...

http://diylaser.blogspot.ca/2012/01/get ... -free.html

Kit


Mon Dec 14, 2015 5:51 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Hi Kit,


Is this OpenBuilds' Open Rail that you are using? It looks like it in your drawing. I love CAD drawing, I use Solidworks.

If it's Open Rail, how do you like it?

I've been trying V-Slot for some things and I really like it. I am using the solid heavy duty wheels, they are great.


Edward


Mon Dec 14, 2015 8:30 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Plenty of interesting projects going on since I left for the sun, back to rain and waiting Ali Warehouse to deliver final stock for my vice project.
Just found this for Fusion360, blink and its easy to miss some useful items, when the "waffle" starts go to 19:00 aprox. I found this more useful than the 360 start up tutorials.

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Tue Dec 15, 2015 6:29 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
All i can say is why would anybody use inches ? :D
D1


Tue Dec 15, 2015 9:23 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
DISPLACEMENT 1 wrote:
All i can say is why would anybody use inches ? :D
D1

Not sure how to turn minutes into mm's - LOL

Like the laser gear, looks like a fine addition to your "shed".

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Tue Dec 15, 2015 10:58 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Edward,
The rail is 'Makerslide' from Inventables. You get a better look at it in the video I posted of the existing machine. I thought the added 'rail' rather than the wheels running in slots would be more reliable but I am getting some sideways play in the existing X axis setup which causes the spindle to tilt back significantly when pushed upwards by the material being cut. This is the reason for the additional, horizontal rail in the new design as drawn.
As D1 said before, a laser cutter can have a much lighter structure since there are no external forces on the moving parts. Oh no, not another project!!!

D1,
Why indeed! There are still some nations in the world that need to be dragged (kicking and screaming) into the 20th century.

Kit


Tue Dec 15, 2015 2:00 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Thank you Kit, I just saw your video.

I can't vouch for the Makerslide, but certainly the V-slot I am using for a cross arm looks very good with no play, using the solid wheels. I am currently building a motorised studio stand/crane , and for that I am using Hewin linear rail (20mm wide) with bearing blocks. This linear rail and bearings are heavy duty and ideal for CNC and in this case I need it to hold a 3 Kg load, so I am taking no chances. I am using the Bosch Rexroth extrusion for convenience, as you can easily get all manners of fittings for it.

That drawing is looking good, practice makes perfect:)

Edward


Tue Dec 15, 2015 3:39 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Since I mentioned V-slot, here is what I am working on at the moment, using V-slot as a cross arm for a studio stand. (It's really a motion controlled crane...)

This is the tilt mechanism with the CNC'ed pieces still to be anodised. You can just about see the Harmonic drive behind, a CSF size 11 driven by belt by a Nema17 motor of the same size. Although using a harmonic drive for stills photography is complete overkill, this will have a dual purpose for video, so having zero backlash is essential.


Edward
Image


Wed Dec 16, 2015 9:52 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Well it seems we are all busy with little projects and i am glad we are all sharing what we are learning . Ok prob not timelaspe anymore but think that boat as sailed long ago .
Hi Edward you always amaze me on the finish you strive for. I am assuming that wasn't done on your little Sieg. Will be interested to see how your studio stand goes . Still cant make my mind up which is best approach for my next project. Motorized studio stand or mini techno crane .
But in the mean time finally getting on with my model mover . Think the Star Wars hype as made me think about buying a Millennium Falcon and trying some nice green screen stuff . Never was a Star Wars fan me more 2001 and Silent running .
Got most of the modeling done and started machining bits about a week ago , no rush on this one . Just a 3 Dof at mo a 6Dof would be much better you can move the nodal point about . But Dragonframe woudnt be able to control that so 3Dof it is .
Progress so far not sure it my universal joints are going to lock up cant really tell from the CG model as theirs no in built mechanical actions in DS . If anybody gets that far with 360 would be interested see how ya go .
[flickr]ImageScreenshot (125) by D 1, on Flickr[/flickr]
[flickr]ImageScreenshot (129) by D 1, on Flickr[/flickr]
[flickr]Image2015-12-16 18.16.34 by D 1, on Flickr[/flickr]
D1


Wed Dec 16, 2015 11:06 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Well, whatever you are doing, it looks complicated:)
The beauty with Solidworks is that it tells you when the articulation conflicts, so it would be helpful for your project. Maybe Fusion does the same, I don't remember.

I can see you are also a heavy user of extrusions. I think they are ideal for tinkerers like us. I will relate my experiences with the studio stand, as I am planning to not use a cross arm counterweight in order to simplify things. Naturally, this requires a robust column. Mine is 2mt high, 40x80 Bosch extrusion with triangular reinforcements at the bottom, tripod-like and with Hewin linear rail. Also I don't have masses of space, so it has to be practical. It should work perfectly to do table top stuff, as good as a conventional crane, I hope. I intend to use servos for everything, but I may start with steppers and then swap to servos if the idea works.

I think timelapse projects co-exist happily with any other engineering projects, the more you build, the more you learn, the quicker you become. Mastering a Cad program is quite essential. There's never been a better time for tinkering, and it is so easy to obtain parts and accessories on the internet. I just ordered some tiny M2 bolts from Ebay, will get them tomorrow, isn't it great!

BTW, I order Openbuilds stuff from Ooznest, so far they've been very good, receiving within 2 days of order I also ordered direct from Openbuilds, which are cheaper but it comes from the US and it takes time plus UPS transport, OK if you are not in a hurry, about 6/7 days.


Edward


Wed Dec 16, 2015 12:16 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Its one of these :D

Yes think 360 does register mechanical conflicts but my thinking is it will be quicker to build it and change if necessary . Think i will be ok done quite a bit of head scratching and as you say ali extrusion is great for changing as you go. I have actually put enough holes so i can make the rig bigger of smaller. The actual activators just bolt onto the corners of the rig .
Used to get the Openbuilds stuff from RoboCutters think they were the only Uk suppler then but that was in the early days . Have you any of the C beam ? I do find the M5 bolt and bearings a bit limiting even M6 would be better . I just find the M5 a bit weak shame really .
D1


Wed Dec 16, 2015 12:58 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Looks like a great project, and very relevant to your work.

Yes, I would prefer the Openbuilds bolts to be M6 or even M8 for the wheels. On the other hand, you can have rows of two or three pairs to reinforce. The problem with their extrusion and rails is that it only goes up to 1.5 mt. a little short for many things, otherwise I quite like it. Their CNC kits look a bit flimsy to me.

Ed


Wed Dec 16, 2015 1:11 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Yes this might explain it more and relevant considering the new Star Wars thing . Thought it may be handy for your job nice how shadows move when manipulate the object rather than the camera

Huge machines back then ! think my little rig and crane will be a lot better plus after effects should be easy ? . My winter project remaking 2001 :D
Try Robocutters it say lengths up to 3 meters i think . I also wonder if it possible to replace the bearings with a larger bore one but same outer diameter . I will have a look on simply bearings website
D1


Wed Dec 16, 2015 1:48 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Thanks D1, I didn't know of V-Track which is apparently compatible with V-Slot and it comes in longer lengths.

Regarding the wheels, yes, you can easily get small bearings 16mm outside dia by 8mm inside. You may have to drill the internal separating rib of the wheels to allow the bolt to pass through, but that's easy.

I went for the heavy duty solid wheels.

Pity that I couldn't see C-beam in longer lengths though.


Edward


Wed Dec 16, 2015 3:11 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Yes you are right about bearings i had a look . The only other problem is you would need a bigger eccentric and much bigger hole for it . Never been able to find a suppler of larger eccentrics . Could machine some up i suppose but do like to buy stuff when i can .
D1


Thu Dec 17, 2015 12:54 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Today I tried the wheels with some weight and the M5 bolts are too weak for the task, let alone their thin gantry plates.
I think the eccentric bushes are easily machined by buying some hexagonal brass stock.

But to be honest, by the time you add the cost of the wheels, machining time, etc, you may as well go for the Hewin linear slider/block, I am coming to the conclusion…



Edward


Thu Dec 17, 2015 10:15 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Yeah my thoughts to . Openbuilds is fine for light weight stuff but can struggle if loaded up to much . Using it on the model mover just because i have it on the shelf's.
Most of the load is down between the ballscrew and all the mounting plates are machined from 5mm ali so should be ok .
D1


Thu Dec 17, 2015 12:09 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Hello Edward this may be of interest . Just machined up a carriage for my model mover used 6.5mm plate so a lot more chunky than Openbuilds standard stuff .
Seems quite rigid even with the standard M5 bolts , i am using steel wheels though dont know if you have tried these . Anyways its def good enough for my use on the model mover may even incorporate this set up in the techno crane .
Image2015-12-19 18.11.46 by D 1, on Flickr
And for all you CAD users finding this library quite good https://grabcad.com/library tend to save as step and import to DS but their may be better ways .
D1


Sat Dec 19, 2015 1:15 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
D1, it looks much better than the 3mm flimsy carriage of Openbuilds. And I like the steel wheels too.

However, I still think I will be using linear tracking (bolted to the extrusion) for the cross arm to avoid sideways wobbling/vibration. With linear rail (either 15 or 20mm wide) you are in effect adding a tremendous steel reinforcement along the length, plus a more robust carriage. For your model mover it would be overkill though, so no worries there. But if you tap with your fingers at the extreme end of the extrusion, I think it will wobble like mad, as 20x60 is not very robust by itself. This may explain why I've seen some CNC routers being too flimsy to get nice smooth finishes (due to vibration).

I have added 20mm steel linear rail to the 2m long column, and it has completely modified its robustness. Now it is like it should be, (I think).

But all this needs a very solid base, so initially I am using an actual studio stand base (I have one spare studio stand) that is made of cast iron, it weighs a lot, to which I will bolt my motorised new column.

And then the whole thing will go on linear tracking to support the weight.

Big project.

Edward


Sun Dec 20, 2015 3:46 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Kit, if you are still looking for tips for wood cutting there is some info in this article that may be useful to you.
http://makezine.com/2014/09/10/endmills/?utm_source=New+Products+12%2F21%2F15+%28CI%235%29&utm_campaign=Dec+21+NL+%28CI%235+%26+New+Products%29&utm_medium=email

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Mon Dec 21, 2015 5:30 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Hi Mike while on subject of tooling tried out your recommendation of Cutwel Tools . Loads of stuff and great catalogue (i like catalogues )
Just done some machining with a slot mill specially for Ali http://www.cutwel.co.uk/milling/milling ... e49-series
Def best Ali cut i have had so far will see how long they last.
[flickr]Image2015-12-22 20.18.25 by D 1, on Flickr[/flickr]
D1


Tue Dec 22, 2015 2:08 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Hi, D1, A weighty catalogue :D , glad the cutter is working well, part looks to have a smooth finish. I have mostly Ali power, 2 flute with a couple of non-Ali power 3 flute that I have yet to try.
I did a 30mm face cut with an 8mm cutter yesterday and despite my PC malfunctions (4) the final climb milling cut was very smooth despite an unavoidable 50mm overhang from a small vice.
PC stripped and rebuilt, seems to be functioning fine now. Vice coming along, was waiting for material so should be finished soon, will post when complete.
Bought a laser edge finder in a sale, best thing since sliced bread :D , like this one http://www.machine-dro.co.uk/electronic ... -4856.html.
Makes setting up much easier than with the mechanical one I have.

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Wed Dec 23, 2015 1:44 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Hi Mike interesting little tool shame you have to take tool out to put laser in collet . I hate changing tools at the best of times .
Its is possible to set up Mach to probe edges and depth . Not done it myself yet but its on the list :(

D1


Wed Dec 23, 2015 2:25 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Hi, D1, an interesting post, here is one for setting up a zeroing option, complete with the script for Mach3.https://www.machsupport.com/forum/index.php?topic=14803.0
It was suggested in another post I read that adding a conductive base to the unit in your post would allow X,Y and Z to be set using one piece of kit. I just leave the tool "loose" in the holder and and lower the Z axis until the tool pushes back into the holder up to the tool shoulder, tighten the holder and zero Z in Mach3.

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Thu Dec 24, 2015 6:08 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Hi Mike sometimes i use a standard chuck to hold bits so its easy to set the z as you say . But if i am using the collet thing it requires banging with a hammer and fiddling with a spanner hence my dislike of tool changing :( .
Really need to sort out the auto function but busy on other things at mo but if i did sort it it would make life a lot easier . End stops would be a good idea to but never got round to fitting those things either Duh !
Just got a Cutwel offers brochure some lovely little vices in their but well out of my price range
D1


Thu Dec 24, 2015 7:41 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
I hope all our readers got what they wanted for Christmas and had a jolly good time in the process.

Mike: Thanks for the link explaining the choice of tools. Straight to the point and very informative.

D1: That piece of your model mover demonstrates why I got into casting Aluminium. I don't have access to stock that thick without paying stupid amounts of freight so I'd make that by using the CNC machine to cut a wooden pattern for a casting which could then be
finished in the same machine.

However, I'll need to upgrade from the current design before then. This is the result of getting too ambitious with cut depth on MDF.

Attachment:
File comment: excessive cut depth!
BrokenCNC.jpg
BrokenCNC.jpg [ 70.81 KiB | Viewed 9806 times ]


Fri Dec 25, 2015 6:11 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Attention D1.
I've been doing a bit more research on laser cutters and came across the article linked below while looking for information on the expected life of a Chinese tube. It appears that tube current is a critical factor and this article explains (not very clearly) how to measure and adjust it. Just be careful. Very careful!

Basically it's telling you to put an ammeter in series with the earth return cable and measure the current.
Just beware of the high voltages due to stored charge in capacitors which can linger long after everything is switched off. In the world of high power wireless telegraphy we use 'earth wands' to discharge any capacitances. These are insulated sticks with an earthed hook on the end. Once the mains is disconnected from your supply, tap the wand on anything vaguely metallic. My mantra is 'If in doubt, dab about'. I haven't died once in over 30 years!

http://www.instructables.com/id/How-to- ... CO2-Laser/

Kit


Sun Dec 27, 2015 5:12 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
What do people around here use for CAD software?


Wed Dec 30, 2015 10:08 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
It may be time for you to spend 10 minutes and read the previous pages in this thread .
You never know it may answer your question .
D1


Wed Dec 30, 2015 12:29 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Recent user http://blog.cnccookbook.com/category/blog/ survey on CAM packages may be helpful even if the scoring method produces 100% + results ? , but as D1 says reading through this thread is worthwhile:
My favourite is graph paper and pencil ;) then transferred to CamBam. (dinosaur ;) )

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Thu Dec 31, 2015 2:11 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
If you know someone with a machine shop, inventor lets you work with assemblies. You can place two parts next to each other, then project the geometry of holes and such on one part through the other. Holes always line up and less math is involved. Of course, edges, inside hollows or other features can be projected through as well. Its pretty expensive for hobby use though.

Inventor also lets you make intelligent drawings where features are defined relative to other features instead of absolute numeric coordinates. For example, you can define screw holes as 5mm in from an edge. if you modify the drawing later by moving the edge, the holes follow, always staying the specified distance from the edge. These definitions can be math formulas. A simple example would be to define length as 1/3 the height. If you scale up the height, the length follows.

You can start a drawing really rough, getting just the gist of the part, the correct number of lines and corners. Then you can go back and set the constraints, making this corner 90 degrees, saying these lines should be parallel to those, perpendicular to those, this should be 25mm long, etc until the drawing is completely constrained. If you start with a normal program like autocad, as i did, it takes a while to get used to this different way of drawing. Starting out with inventor would be a lot easier than moving from another program.

Inventor pro has a gear maker too, but the regular version doesn't.


Sat Jan 02, 2016 8:00 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
MikeA wrote:
My favourite is graph paper and pencil ;) then transferred to CamBam. (dinosaur ;) )


Mike: After all the frustration I've had trying to get my head round Fusion 360, I'm with you. One should always remember that for any particular task it is sensible to use the appropriate technology, not simply the latest.

Kit


Sat Jan 02, 2016 8:02 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Back of the subject of tooling . Found the Alu Power do give a nice cut but mine didn't last long . Not gone blunt but i have knocked of the tips of the cutting surface.
They are very brittle i was just lowering tool onto surface without spindle going and that was enough to cause it to fracture . Will get another one and try and treat i better .
D1


Thu Jan 07, 2016 5:44 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
DISPLACEMENT 1 wrote:
Back of the subject of tooling . Found the Alu Power do give a nice cut but mine didn't last long . Not gone blunt but i have knocked of the tips of the cutting surface.
They are very brittle i was just lowering tool onto surface without spindle going and that was enough to cause it to fracture . Will get another one and try and treat i better .
D1


If you are using the cutters with 6mm shaft then they make good dowel pins ;)

Have done the same myself started a cut without spindle rotating :(

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Thu Jan 07, 2016 6:14 am
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
I've never broken a tool yet! Look at the picture further up the thread and you'll see why :(


Thu Jan 07, 2016 5:10 pm
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Post Re: CAD, CAM, CNC etc.
Kitwn wrote:
I've never broken a tool yet! Look at the picture further up the thread and you'll see why :(


Hi, Kit, hopefully I will stay with broken cutting tools - LOL.

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Fri Jan 08, 2016 2:16 am
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