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 Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom 
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Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2016 10:31 am
Posts: 43
Post Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
Hey folks.

Making a lot of progress on my rig. I have an ongoing blog (i make no money off clicks, and there are no ads) of the progress that can be seen here.

http://biolapse.com/

But since I'm not a click bait kind of guy, I will cliff note it with some pics.

The powerbox is built. 6 CWD556 drivers and 4 Leadshine DM432c drivers. Motor disable switches installed, it all works like a champ. I dig this server case. it is probably bigger than it needs to be, but the built in fans are a bonus, plus it was easy enough to modify.

DMC-16 is awesome. I love it. The limit switches are installed for X and Y, still need to do Z and the 3D Mini.

Displacement1, PM me and let me know the issues you had with limit switches. if you use any of them, ALL unused have to be plugged into common. Need to us N.O. switches. There are some considerations to keep in mind with them.

Image


The frame turned out fantastic. The overall shooting envelope is about 4.5ft x 4.5ft x 26 inches. Everything is nice and solid.

Image

the Y axis is damn near touching the ceiling. It was a bit of work getting this all worked out. The first brackets i used on the Y axis (seen above) were just thrown together. This caused some real bad shaking and shitty movement at slower speeds. (it also did not help the couplings i got were the wrong size and i just drilled them out by hand, the new ones that are made to the proper specs work better). I used some 1/2inch aluminum stock and made some nice strong brackets and now everything works much better.

Image


Here is the rig with the Z axis and P/T connected. I am hoping to get the Z axis working this weekend. I ran into some issues with getting the spool for the winch. Unfortunatly the lathe i have access to us just a hair too small. SO I'm piecing one together to make sure it works before having to pay a machinist to lathe it out for me.

Image


The PT itself was WAY big. I knew as soon as i got it i would end up modifying it.
This is the PT2100 stock.
Image

The biggest problem i see is the TILT axis is closer to the camera than the Roll, so if the camera is tilted and you use the roll, the camera arcs instead of rolling.
I removed one of the arms on the ROLL and put the camera sideways on the tilt, effectivly swapping those axis and it is much better.

Image

Of course it looks weird, so i took apart the $1600 pan tilt and hacked it apart with my Miter Saw.

Much better
Image


The X and Y move nice and smoothly. Not nearly as fast as some of the other rigs, but plenty fast enough for real time motion with the size of stage I work with.

The Z axis should be working in a few days. The bearings I used are wonderful and really do a great job of keeping things in place.

Pan, Tilt, Roll all work like a dream. Nice and smooth. A little under 4 seconds for a complete 360 rotation of any of the axis.

3D should be setup this weekend too, as well as the focus.

I have a lot of finishing work to do, cable carriers just arrived, need to run quite a few more cables, but i am pleased with the progress so far. I should be up and shooting in a few more days.


Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:06 pm
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Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2016 10:31 am
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Post Re: Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
If anyone is interested, here is the control center.

I decided to use a laptop instead of desktop, the battery is like a free UPS.
Under that is the DMC 16, then the power center.
Cheapo computer desk with a 24 inch 3D monitor. Wireless keyboard and mouse cause i hate working on laptops.
Couple small 7 inch monitors on the left for framing up the SONY A7's that have been demoted to secondary cameras.
I also plan to run my eMotimo through Dragonframe for x y and focus, with one of the spare drivers in the power box controlling a rail. This gives me a 8 degree system, a 4 axis, and i can still run a turntable at the same time.

Image


Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:10 pm
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Joined: Sun Aug 28, 2016 2:25 am
Posts: 19
Post Re: Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
Having a single leadscrew and motor centered on such a wide span is not really the best method as the carriage wont move up the axis square it will pinch on a corner and twist that could cause low speed snagging tandem/dual motor and leadscew or belt on either side would be better.

Im still impressed I'd love to have a rig like this and I can picture the look on the oh face when I suggest it.



Image


Fri Oct 21, 2016 11:04 pm
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Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 1:18 pm
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Post Re: Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
Hi Chris looking good you going to have a lot of fun with that . If Visualbyte comment is correct you can always run another ballscrew and motor of the same step direction control . Thats what tends to happen on CNC routers but you may be ok . Give it a go as it is, with a router you are applying a lot of force to router bit . You just pushing air more or less :D .
Yeah DMC is great miss the one i had . Still considering Mantis but its rapidly becoming obvious that 8 channels is just not enough when you have a full rig plus model movers .
If you dont mind discussing the limit switches in open space that would be good i am a bit anti PM not really good for other people on the forum . After all we all hear to learn of each other.
Yes i connected all the switches not been used . I am just wondering if i used the right pin out numbers on the socket . I will try and find the reference i used.
Cheers


Sat Oct 22, 2016 3:22 am
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Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 10:45 am
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Location: Merritt Island, Florida, Estates Unitas
Post Re: Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
Amazing rig Chris !

So running two rigs from one DMC16 sounds pretty unique. I guess both shots have to share the same timeline. Have you actually tried it yet? I'm also curious about how multiple cameras work this way. Do you use identical cameras and a USB splitter and does Dragonframe actually think they are one camera? And which live view does the Dragonframe software display? Or are you using the flash synch of the first camera to trigger the one on the second rig? Just curious because I've never seen a one controller-two rig system before.


Sun Oct 23, 2016 7:31 am
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Joined: Wed Jan 20, 2010 4:50 pm
Posts: 561
Post Re: Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
Hi SL. Running two rigs is the same as running one. The second rig is just extra axes in the same timeline. In D1's scenario a second camera is not used - as the extra axes are for for model moving.

BTW I expect to get 16 axes going in the new year with Mantis. I have two controllers running simultaneously for test purposes, so it's basically a matter of adding extra channels to the software. I expect to have a system where you can toggle between the first and second set so you can program both in the usual way. The challenge is to keep it relatively uncluttered so it works with a relatively low resolution screen. (Important for portable systems.)


Sun Oct 23, 2016 10:06 pm
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Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2016 10:31 am
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Post Re: Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
Visualbyte wrote:
Having a single leadscrew and motor centered on such a wide span is not really the best method as the carriage wont move up the axis square it will pinch on a corner and twist that could cause low speed snagging tandem/dual motor and leadscew or belt on either side would be better.

Im still impressed I'd love to have a rig like this and I can picture the look on the oh face when I suggest it.



Thanks Visualbyte,

So far the single ball screw seems to be working okay. Right now the Z is axis complete, pan tilt on, camera on, pretty much full weight has been applied and it seems to be doing OK, however proof will be in the testing as to whether or not I need it. I am certainly not opposed and will probably end up adding one in.


D1,
So my experience with the limit switches has been a bit wonky. You have to use NC, and bridge the non used switches. Wiring them out as seen below seems to work, however i noticed the HIGH switch wont allow back movement away from the switch whereas the low will. I have not had enough time to play around with it, but they do seem to work.
1. Limit 1 Low
2. Limit 1 High
3. Limit 1 Common
4. Limit 2 Low
5. Limit 2 High
6. Limit 2 Common
7. Limit 3 Low
8. Limit 3 High
9. Limit 3 Common
10. Limit 4 Low
11. Limit 4 High
12. Limit 4 Common
13. Limit 5 Low
14. Limit 5 High
15. Limit 5 Common
16. Limit 6 Low
17. Limit 6 High
18. Limit 6 Common
19. Limit 7 Low
20. Limit 7 High
21. Limit 7 Common
22. Limit 8 Low
23. Limit 8 High
24. Limit 8 Common

I got my Z axis working! the winch setup works out well. I am using a spool that I hobbled together and so far it works like a champ, however it was put together by hand in an attempt to test the winch and see if it will hold. it is not perfectly centered so I will have to get with a machinist to get the final spool made. But I am pretty pleased that the proof in principle works. The elevator system is awfully heavy and i was worried the lift wouldn't be strong enough.



So all that's left is to wire in Focus and the 3D stereo slider, throw in some more limit switches.

Power to the camera proved to be a PITA. The connector on the power supply to the camera cannot be routed through the PT2100 as is, so i had to cut it and add a connector that would fit. I opeed just to use a 3.5mm stereo jacks as extentions would be easy to find. The problem is the loss of power over more than a few extra feet added to the normal length is enough to prevent the camera from starting. So ill have to run a power cable from the wall all the way to the Pt2100.
USB works fine though.

James,
Geraldft is correct, you run both fom the same timeline. The primary rig would get full use of dragonframe whereas the secondary is framed up using a secondary monitor. As long as the shooting times are the same for both rigs it shouldnt be a problem. I am used to running 3-4 cameras all manually but for the same amount of time on the same intervals. As for triggering multiple cameras, i have a smart splitter that i built which can trigger up to 8 cameras and slaves off a single input. Each channel is isolated and can be programmed for extra delay, double trigger, etc. No interface though it is manually adjusted in Arduino IDE if needed.


Mon Oct 24, 2016 9:52 am
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Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 1:18 pm
Posts: 1294
Post Re: Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
Hi Chris thats looking really good combined with the 3D you going to some real nice natural history stuff. Hope somebody pays you a decent amount for your footage.
Cant think what i have done differently on the limit switch front but mine def didn't work . Not having the rig anymore makes it hard to do any more testing . This was the pin ref i used .
[flickr]ImageScreenshot (280) by D 1, on Flickr[/flickr]

and yes normally closed limit switches . All a bit of a puzzle everything else worked great though . Have you played with the DMX yet bet you could get some great lighting effects .

Cheers D1


Mon Oct 24, 2016 12:25 pm
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Joined: Tue Aug 09, 2016 10:31 am
Posts: 43
Post Re: Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
Yeah the DMX stuff is pretty impressive. I picked up four small RGB LED DMX lights as well as a 4 channel dimmer pack. I have not had a chance to really put them to use but I did play around with them a bit, and im totally sold on the idea of controlling the lighting through DF. I like the idea of shifting light exposure throughout the routine :)


Mon Oct 24, 2016 12:32 pm
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Joined: Tue Apr 09, 2013 6:49 pm
Posts: 175
Post Re: Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
geraldft wrote:
Hi SL. Running two rigs is the same as running one. The second rig is just extra axes in the same timeline. In D1's scenario a second camera is not used - as the extra axes are for for model moving.

BTW I expect to get 16 axes going in the new year with Mantis. I have two controllers running simultaneously for test purposes, so it's basically a matter of adding extra channels to the software. I expect to have a system where you can toggle between the first and second set so you can program both in the usual way. The challenge is to keep it relatively uncluttered so it works with a relatively low resolution screen. (Important for portable systems.)



This would be really cool to have Gerald.

Hey Chris, nice rig! Really cool actually!


Wed Oct 26, 2016 9:40 am
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Posts: 306
Post Re: Rig Progress Dragonframe, 8 degrees of freedom
very impressive


Wed Dec 07, 2016 2:42 am
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